I know this is not one of AHP's 'recommendation' threads but... I would love to know if there's a podcast out there that's similar to the way Forever 35 is described on its landing page, but that DOESN'T talk about self-care as necessarily involving products? I read this piece and thought: wow, these sound like people I want to listen to. Then I went over to the landing page. There's a massive heading about talking about serums. The first sentence of the next paragraph adds mascara. I am - personally, you do you etc etc - **SO VERY DONE** with the idea that cosmetics are a reliable route to 'self care' and while it sounds like they cover a lot of things I'd love to be listening to (I'm in my mid-40s), I cannot bear more product talk. Any pointers, I'd be much obliged.
I can totally see and understand your frustration. I listen to Pantsuit Politics a lot - and skip forward through their ads. I realize that's how they make their money, but I'd rather support them on Patreon and guiltlessly fast-forward on their mattress, bike short, mental health app, vitamin, etc.
I'm not a parent but am a very involved Aunt interested in parenting content and if you like the idea of Forever35 (two friends chatting) but without the heavy product focus I recommend Friendlier (two friends/Moms talking on a topic, no ads, their convos seem really organic, def not product heavy at all, new eps every other week), The Girl Next Door (similar to Friendlier but I personally feel like I have more in common with the Friendlier hosts, new eps every other week) and then The Mom Hours (they have a giant back catalog, I've grown to really love the hosts but only listen when a topic piques my interest, they often have multiple pods that come out in a week).
I am not a parent either (not by choice)... I have to admit, I am a little envious of the automatic "in" that parents get into community networks, simply by virtue of being parents and the common experiences they share in that regard. (Case in point: a commenter above notes "IRL community matters so much - and parenting is a huge part of community.") Those of us who aren't parenting have to work harder to build new connections and to maintain our connections with friends & relatives who are parenting (and who don't always have the time or energy for us on top of everything else on their plate). It can be very difficult and frankly very lonely sometimes.
AHP, I would LOVE for you to chat with Jody Day of Gateway Women about the childless (not by choice) experience and bridging the gap between parents and non-parents. :)
The Mom Hour is pretty parenting focused (except when they release More Than Mom eps which are on non-parenting topics) whereas Friendlier and The Girl Next Door have some parenting topics and some non parenting topics but since the hosts are all parents that experience is obviously threaded through most episodes.
IRL community matters so much - and parenting is a huge part of community.
We live in a big city but within, there is the neighborhood community, and at smaller scale, our street community. We care for each other. For example, three of my neighbors are widows - all over 65 y/o, and we help care for them in a myriad of small acts. We have done this for years, never expecting a return - as a way for my husband and I to teach our sons how to be good citizens. My boys shovel walks, return garbage cans to backyards, mow grass, my husband fixes the squeaky fence gate, etc.
TW~ When our older son Olivier tragically died this winter (innocent victim of gun violence), we were completely shattered - but this community we had nurtured, turned around and cared for us in a manner we never expected. Neither of us have family close by. We were humbled by their love, kindness and support. Through parenting, we cultivated an environment where mutual aid is the norm, not the exception. We dearly wish we hadn’t needed a “return on our community investment”, but the reality is that sooner or later we all need a little help from our friends. I can’t help but think that social media by robbing us from IRL interactions and thriving on reactionary content, is responsible for the empathy deficit that seems pervasive these days. And a little empathy goes a long way in creating and maintaining healthy communities. A world where widows can continue to live independently in their own homes, and where their 20 year old helpers can walk the streets at 10pm without fear of deadly violence.
I saw someone ask this on Twitter and didn’t see any answers so I would love to pose it here: what, exactly, does all this “build community” talk mean in concrete real terms? I would very much like either examples or a check list or an assignment….?
I wrote about this at length on my own newsletter (spoiler alert! there are no easy answers), but to sum up: what I'd start with is deciding on two areas you deeply care about and have skill or talent to contribute to (in my case, it's public education, specifically math, and walkability/walking infrastructure). Look around your community and see if you can find who's already doing something. If not, start by attending school board and/or city council meetings. Like even one or two a year. I found teaming up with other parents to spread this around really hoped. Most of us can't get to these meetings at the time they're held, so we take turns and report back. Walkability is something I care about a ton, but I also find it's a natural way to get involved (also a natural way to become extremely frustrated with civics and city budgets and priorities). Where are sidewalks missing or broken? Why's there no safe crosswalk by the school? Does the school's transportation plan not do enough to encourage non-car avenues to school? What's involved in getting a traffic light installed at an unsafe road crossing? That kind of thing.
But something like food banks can be an easy entry, especially if your food bank (if you have one and if not there's a need right there) has a program that, like ours, packs "weekend food" for kids who are on the free school lunch program and also teams up with local farms for picking and gleaning fresh produce.
I think one issue people run into with the real work of building community is that a lot of it's incredibly dull. City council meetings are boring. Planning board meetings are mind-numbing. School board meetings are full of tedious budget details speckled with people complaining. But that's where you can start finding the real work that's being done and see how to get involved. And community, at its core, is about building connection and trust, whatever that looks like.
I love this idea! My biggest frustration is the sheer amount of TIME it takes to change things via civic action and knowing how little time I have until we move again. But for those like me who move frequently something I've figured out is to show up at a charity I support - or a local branch of a national charity - and say something like, "I'm me. Here are my strengths. You have me for 2 years. How can I help?" That way they know to stick me on the shorter term projects - put me on a TNR team at the local cat rescue but don't ask me to foster because I'm usually renting a home, for example.
Yeah, I imagine in a life like yours where you're not going to be able to stay long-term, it's going to look different, right? It seems like something like cat rescues or food banks are an ideal place to get involved. Though I'll say that the parents of one of my kids' classmates are military and the mom shows up at a lot of school board meetings! I think they might have been discharged already, though. It's really helpful to have her perspective because most people move where I live for skiing and wilderness kind of things. Maybe that's a bigger conversation, but there is so little interaction between military and civilian families in the U.S., and I certainly benefit in unexpected ways from having had a relative in the military.
Oh yeah! Start easily! Do you know who your neighbors are? Do you interact with them? If not, get out and introduce yourself! (And if one gives you the heebie-jeebies simply go to the next house... or farm... or apartment.) It is WAAAYYY too easy to simply nod at people for years and never have a real conversation.
If you are at least on a nodding basis, can you come together and create opportunities to get to know each other? Maybe drag the grill into the front yard rather than the back and have a sidewalk party? My mom's street one has a traveling house party - they went to each house and had an appetizer. It ended up being a Tapas party! She still talks about it years later and is still good friends with her old neighbors.
Who are your people? Where can you find like minds in your local community? GO to those places and get involved!
Where can you share your strengths and gifts? What does it mean to you to serve? Who or what do you want to serve? By being a part of something bigger than ourselves, we automatically get outside of our own heads and become part of a community.
I think the primary key is to get out and GO - and be your authentic self when you get there. I'm not knocking the online world here! But after the last 2 years of isolation (SAHM + COVID + moving early into a pandemic = TOO MUCH ZOOM) I am hungry for the company of other humans!
I don't know, but I struggle with this too. The layout of my townhome makes it difficult to just hang out in the front, but I do try to talk to people when we are by the mailbox at the same time etc. I am out of town for a work conference the day of our annual HOA meeting, so I won't get to attend that to get to talk to more people, but I am interested in getting to know my neighbors somehow.
There's not much of a road map for community building. I tried building community with those around me, but once my trauma became too much to mange, people really turned on me. Once I was no longer able to provide support to a board I was on, make connections for others in their job search, host parties, etc., people disappeared. I felt hated by the community I tried to hard to build in a city I had moved to. I ended up in abusive relationships with therapists who undermined my efforts to identify my needs and ask for them to be met. There's a thread I read on twitter recently on white social contract https://twitter.com/MiriamForster/status/1472635173103554567 that helped me understand that once I failed to conform and debilitated by PTSD I was abandoned by my community. So a big piece is finding people who believe in community care.
I love Forever 35 podcast (my friend Dr. Lizzie Cleary was interviewed on there not too long ago) and I wasn't aware of the newsletter -- just subscribed!
When it comes to online communities for parents and especially moms, I find there are two circles that likely overlap like a Venn diagram: one is hyperlocal (for needs like finding secondhand gear, getting nanny referrals, where are the best playgrounds, etc.) and one is personal (the type of women you'd actually like to hang out with, and usually ones who have similar backgrounds). Layer on to that is another potential circle that is based on special interests (special needs kids? sleeping problems?).
There is immense value created in these communities. But I think we are still figuring out the economics of community building and community belonging. Even if we argue that such communities create value to participants, regardless of any monetary output or gain to such participants, communities don't exist for free. And there is very much a live question as to how we build these communities so that members are not just consumers and participants, but also the ones who build and reap the economic rewards. Because on Facebook groups, it's Meta that reaps the economic rewards. On Substack, it's currently Substack and the individual creators. Considering Substack paid subscriptions appear to be trending heavily towards community building, Substack needs to figure out how to fold in community members and participants into the economic benefits (perhaps pushing into web3).
My husband recently took command of a military unit. I am ecstatic because for the first time in forever I can go back to being a part of a small community - and now I'm helping to build and create the culture within the unit's families! (The first things we're focusing on are what needs there are within the unit, how can we meet this needs internally, what resources I can link to on the installation and within the greater community, etc.) I am so looking forward to this!
I'm also focused on creating my own community of local support - which means defining who my people are then finding areas where I can find them. (I can rely on fellow command spouses, but finding like minds can be difficult.) For instance, I practice Centering Prayer - so where are the local groups that meet for it? Or are there other meditation groups focused on silence with whom I can practice CP as they do their thing? I'm fascinated by the intersection of theology and social justice, so where are those folks hanging out and how can I get involved? (Hint... I usually start with nuns. :D)
One of the unique things about being in the military, especially on a 2 year tour, is how quickly I have to either throw myself into things and start building relationships... or accept isolation. In my experience there's not a real middle ground (and that was even pre-COVID). This becomes a reason that I focus on building relationships within the military, then turn to locals. For instance, we can move into a new area and check out a local Catholic church - but they won't let us serve until they've had a year to get to know us to make sure we're good Catholics. The parish on base accepts us dang near instantly - and as soon as they discover we want to serve we're on all the lists. :) My biggest stumbling block right now is that my people (Centering Prayer, meditation, social justice and theology, etc) can be hard to find on an installation,, which forces me out into the community to find these pockets of wisdom and strength.
Lynn, do you have any recommendations for ways of extended family of military to connect/build community when we’re not local? My younger brother is an ROTC cadet and likely entering active duty next year. I know very little about what the future holds for him and want to support him the best way possible!
Same! I remember reading a book years ago about how shafted mothers get financially in the U.S. and one of the chapters was about how little resources or networks there were for dads who at a minimum just wanted to "dad" better.
Honestly, I am now the parent of school age kids and one thing that strikes me is that it was so much easier to make friends when my kids were babies. We all knew we needed support and were THERE for each other. It seems like the more self-sufficient the kids get, the less the parents around us interact, if that makes sense?
A friend sent me one of Glennon Doyle's recent podcasts about friendships, and one of the things that hit home was how isolating it can be parenting teens. When they're younger they're in a way part of your own self so it feels somewhat okay talking openly about things, but as they move into teen years the struggles and heartaches are part of their own individual selves, not ours to share. I know there are books on parenting teens and teen brains, but I feel like there's a big gap in being able to step back as a parent and perceive this whole individual human becoming themselves while you're still a parent thing. Anyway, that's slightly tangential but feels slightly related to the decrease in parents connecting thing.
I have found the exact opposite to be true for me. Now that my daughter is in school, I have a chance to meet other parents. When she was younger, I was incredibly isolated, especially because I worked. And I worked mostly non-parents so they often totally didn’t grasp me leaving work and going to my second job as mom. I didn’t have the opportunity to build any relationships with other parents at all.
Oh this is interesting to me! I'm a new mom (babe is less than a year) and at least right NOW I feel very well supported by my Bumper group on Reddit, a local neighborhood mom group where we swap resources, and carefully choosing the mom content folks on Instagram. Also I have been on Babycenter for a loooong time. I stumbled across their "toxic inlaws & family" support groups at one point and never left. I'm happy to learn about Doree's newsletter though!
I was going to say, Reddit is just such a huge huge part of this now. Not just bumper groups (though my wife is active in both of hers and I think an enormous amount of her parenting content comes through that), but all sorts of other subs as well. I'm also in a couple neighborhood parent Facebook groups that are fairly active, to say nothing of the local PTO's website/portal/thingy and various WhatsApp chains and Google Groups for groups of parents of kids at one daycare or another.
Also, that DC group is not the last of its kind! Park Slope Parents in Brooklyn is still very much keeping its 1997-era message board running and very active (you have to pay dues to join and I think there are paid staff that moderate etc.) and I know there's a similar (rival?) group one neighborhood over for BoCoCa parents.
As a mom who is about to turn 35 tomorrow, the timing of this couldn't have been more perfect. I'm still on facebook but haven't really posted in the past month and have been missing mom spaces. Doree, I just subscribed and I'm looking forward to reading all of your posts!!
My kids are grown, so I'm not as on top of this as I used to be, but: Damn, do I miss the days of the decidedly-not-mainstream Hip Mama message boards in the early 2000s. They (and their successors) eventually imploded, but that info exchange and solidarity changed my life, and I'm still friends with so many of the women I met there. Maybe we should resurrect now and call it Hip Meno, cuz many of us are headed there if we're not there already...
I’ve been listening to Forever 35 off and mostly on since it first started. Doree and Kate have honestly dropped nuggets of wisdom on me that fully changed my life. Specifically, I now read for actual pleasure rather than reading (or not reading) literature because I feel like I have something to prove to my literature degree.
I didn’t know that Doree had started a parenting newsletter- now subscribed!
7 years ago when I first gave birth, the Longest Shortest Time Facebook group saved me. And then promptly (wishing 6 months) dissolved into infighting. I joined tons more Facebook groups only to never really find my people. Then the forever 35 group changed my life again because it felt safe to talk to people about superficial things, but also feel seen. I’ve since completely left Facebook. I only superficially skate across Instagram, and I’ve felt more disconnected. But then it’s also less of a time suck (more reading what I want to read).
I admit, I hesitate to try discord. Somehow engagement with strangers doesn’t scratch the itch it once did. Maybe because I am finally starting to make a few real friends. Maybe something else. I don’t know.
And yet here I am typing this comment into the abyss.
Anyway. I’m so glad you did this interview Anne! I’m very excited to dive into Doree’s newsletter.
Thank you so much for sharing Doree with us! I hadn't been made aware of her. I try and unpack a lot of the motherhood and identity issues in my Substack, The Mother Lode, which I launched in November 2021. I also have found a very welcoming and forthcoming group of mothers on Not Safe for Moms Group, which yes, is Facebook, but it just feels really good to have a space where it safe to talk about things many people DON'T talk about in mom groups. I also love what Mom Life Comics does on Instagram; it isn't a community. But it does make me feel seen in a very refreshing way.
I know this is not one of AHP's 'recommendation' threads but... I would love to know if there's a podcast out there that's similar to the way Forever 35 is described on its landing page, but that DOESN'T talk about self-care as necessarily involving products? I read this piece and thought: wow, these sound like people I want to listen to. Then I went over to the landing page. There's a massive heading about talking about serums. The first sentence of the next paragraph adds mascara. I am - personally, you do you etc etc - **SO VERY DONE** with the idea that cosmetics are a reliable route to 'self care' and while it sounds like they cover a lot of things I'd love to be listening to (I'm in my mid-40s), I cannot bear more product talk. Any pointers, I'd be much obliged.
I can totally see and understand your frustration. I listen to Pantsuit Politics a lot - and skip forward through their ads. I realize that's how they make their money, but I'd rather support them on Patreon and guiltlessly fast-forward on their mattress, bike short, mental health app, vitamin, etc.
I'm not a parent but am a very involved Aunt interested in parenting content and if you like the idea of Forever35 (two friends chatting) but without the heavy product focus I recommend Friendlier (two friends/Moms talking on a topic, no ads, their convos seem really organic, def not product heavy at all, new eps every other week), The Girl Next Door (similar to Friendlier but I personally feel like I have more in common with the Friendlier hosts, new eps every other week) and then The Mom Hours (they have a giant back catalog, I've grown to really love the hosts but only listen when a topic piques my interest, they often have multiple pods that come out in a week).
I am not a parent either (not by choice)... I have to admit, I am a little envious of the automatic "in" that parents get into community networks, simply by virtue of being parents and the common experiences they share in that regard. (Case in point: a commenter above notes "IRL community matters so much - and parenting is a huge part of community.") Those of us who aren't parenting have to work harder to build new connections and to maintain our connections with friends & relatives who are parenting (and who don't always have the time or energy for us on top of everything else on their plate). It can be very difficult and frankly very lonely sometimes.
AHP, I would LOVE for you to chat with Jody Day of Gateway Women about the childless (not by choice) experience and bridging the gap between parents and non-parents. :)
Love that you rec'd Friendlier :) I went to grad school with one of the hosts!
The Mom Hour is pretty parenting focused (except when they release More Than Mom eps which are on non-parenting topics) whereas Friendlier and The Girl Next Door have some parenting topics and some non parenting topics but since the hosts are all parents that experience is obviously threaded through most episodes.
IRL community matters so much - and parenting is a huge part of community.
We live in a big city but within, there is the neighborhood community, and at smaller scale, our street community. We care for each other. For example, three of my neighbors are widows - all over 65 y/o, and we help care for them in a myriad of small acts. We have done this for years, never expecting a return - as a way for my husband and I to teach our sons how to be good citizens. My boys shovel walks, return garbage cans to backyards, mow grass, my husband fixes the squeaky fence gate, etc.
TW~ When our older son Olivier tragically died this winter (innocent victim of gun violence), we were completely shattered - but this community we had nurtured, turned around and cared for us in a manner we never expected. Neither of us have family close by. We were humbled by their love, kindness and support. Through parenting, we cultivated an environment where mutual aid is the norm, not the exception. We dearly wish we hadn’t needed a “return on our community investment”, but the reality is that sooner or later we all need a little help from our friends. I can’t help but think that social media by robbing us from IRL interactions and thriving on reactionary content, is responsible for the empathy deficit that seems pervasive these days. And a little empathy goes a long way in creating and maintaining healthy communities. A world where widows can continue to live independently in their own homes, and where their 20 year old helpers can walk the streets at 10pm without fear of deadly violence.
I saw someone ask this on Twitter and didn’t see any answers so I would love to pose it here: what, exactly, does all this “build community” talk mean in concrete real terms? I would very much like either examples or a check list or an assignment….?
I wrote about this at length on my own newsletter (spoiler alert! there are no easy answers), but to sum up: what I'd start with is deciding on two areas you deeply care about and have skill or talent to contribute to (in my case, it's public education, specifically math, and walkability/walking infrastructure). Look around your community and see if you can find who's already doing something. If not, start by attending school board and/or city council meetings. Like even one or two a year. I found teaming up with other parents to spread this around really hoped. Most of us can't get to these meetings at the time they're held, so we take turns and report back. Walkability is something I care about a ton, but I also find it's a natural way to get involved (also a natural way to become extremely frustrated with civics and city budgets and priorities). Where are sidewalks missing or broken? Why's there no safe crosswalk by the school? Does the school's transportation plan not do enough to encourage non-car avenues to school? What's involved in getting a traffic light installed at an unsafe road crossing? That kind of thing.
But something like food banks can be an easy entry, especially if your food bank (if you have one and if not there's a need right there) has a program that, like ours, packs "weekend food" for kids who are on the free school lunch program and also teams up with local farms for picking and gleaning fresh produce.
I think one issue people run into with the real work of building community is that a lot of it's incredibly dull. City council meetings are boring. Planning board meetings are mind-numbing. School board meetings are full of tedious budget details speckled with people complaining. But that's where you can start finding the real work that's being done and see how to get involved. And community, at its core, is about building connection and trust, whatever that looks like.
I love this idea! My biggest frustration is the sheer amount of TIME it takes to change things via civic action and knowing how little time I have until we move again. But for those like me who move frequently something I've figured out is to show up at a charity I support - or a local branch of a national charity - and say something like, "I'm me. Here are my strengths. You have me for 2 years. How can I help?" That way they know to stick me on the shorter term projects - put me on a TNR team at the local cat rescue but don't ask me to foster because I'm usually renting a home, for example.
Yeah, I imagine in a life like yours where you're not going to be able to stay long-term, it's going to look different, right? It seems like something like cat rescues or food banks are an ideal place to get involved. Though I'll say that the parents of one of my kids' classmates are military and the mom shows up at a lot of school board meetings! I think they might have been discharged already, though. It's really helpful to have her perspective because most people move where I live for skiing and wilderness kind of things. Maybe that's a bigger conversation, but there is so little interaction between military and civilian families in the U.S., and I certainly benefit in unexpected ways from having had a relative in the military.
Oh yeah! Start easily! Do you know who your neighbors are? Do you interact with them? If not, get out and introduce yourself! (And if one gives you the heebie-jeebies simply go to the next house... or farm... or apartment.) It is WAAAYYY too easy to simply nod at people for years and never have a real conversation.
If you are at least on a nodding basis, can you come together and create opportunities to get to know each other? Maybe drag the grill into the front yard rather than the back and have a sidewalk party? My mom's street one has a traveling house party - they went to each house and had an appetizer. It ended up being a Tapas party! She still talks about it years later and is still good friends with her old neighbors.
I posted a longer answer above, but highlights:
Who are your people? Where can you find like minds in your local community? GO to those places and get involved!
Where can you share your strengths and gifts? What does it mean to you to serve? Who or what do you want to serve? By being a part of something bigger than ourselves, we automatically get outside of our own heads and become part of a community.
I think the primary key is to get out and GO - and be your authentic self when you get there. I'm not knocking the online world here! But after the last 2 years of isolation (SAHM + COVID + moving early into a pandemic = TOO MUCH ZOOM) I am hungry for the company of other humans!
I don't know, but I struggle with this too. The layout of my townhome makes it difficult to just hang out in the front, but I do try to talk to people when we are by the mailbox at the same time etc. I am out of town for a work conference the day of our annual HOA meeting, so I won't get to attend that to get to talk to more people, but I am interested in getting to know my neighbors somehow.
There's not much of a road map for community building. I tried building community with those around me, but once my trauma became too much to mange, people really turned on me. Once I was no longer able to provide support to a board I was on, make connections for others in their job search, host parties, etc., people disappeared. I felt hated by the community I tried to hard to build in a city I had moved to. I ended up in abusive relationships with therapists who undermined my efforts to identify my needs and ask for them to be met. There's a thread I read on twitter recently on white social contract https://twitter.com/MiriamForster/status/1472635173103554567 that helped me understand that once I failed to conform and debilitated by PTSD I was abandoned by my community. So a big piece is finding people who believe in community care.
I love Forever 35 podcast (my friend Dr. Lizzie Cleary was interviewed on there not too long ago) and I wasn't aware of the newsletter -- just subscribed!
When it comes to online communities for parents and especially moms, I find there are two circles that likely overlap like a Venn diagram: one is hyperlocal (for needs like finding secondhand gear, getting nanny referrals, where are the best playgrounds, etc.) and one is personal (the type of women you'd actually like to hang out with, and usually ones who have similar backgrounds). Layer on to that is another potential circle that is based on special interests (special needs kids? sleeping problems?).
There is immense value created in these communities. But I think we are still figuring out the economics of community building and community belonging. Even if we argue that such communities create value to participants, regardless of any monetary output or gain to such participants, communities don't exist for free. And there is very much a live question as to how we build these communities so that members are not just consumers and participants, but also the ones who build and reap the economic rewards. Because on Facebook groups, it's Meta that reaps the economic rewards. On Substack, it's currently Substack and the individual creators. Considering Substack paid subscriptions appear to be trending heavily towards community building, Substack needs to figure out how to fold in community members and participants into the economic benefits (perhaps pushing into web3).
My husband recently took command of a military unit. I am ecstatic because for the first time in forever I can go back to being a part of a small community - and now I'm helping to build and create the culture within the unit's families! (The first things we're focusing on are what needs there are within the unit, how can we meet this needs internally, what resources I can link to on the installation and within the greater community, etc.) I am so looking forward to this!
I'm also focused on creating my own community of local support - which means defining who my people are then finding areas where I can find them. (I can rely on fellow command spouses, but finding like minds can be difficult.) For instance, I practice Centering Prayer - so where are the local groups that meet for it? Or are there other meditation groups focused on silence with whom I can practice CP as they do their thing? I'm fascinated by the intersection of theology and social justice, so where are those folks hanging out and how can I get involved? (Hint... I usually start with nuns. :D)
One of the unique things about being in the military, especially on a 2 year tour, is how quickly I have to either throw myself into things and start building relationships... or accept isolation. In my experience there's not a real middle ground (and that was even pre-COVID). This becomes a reason that I focus on building relationships within the military, then turn to locals. For instance, we can move into a new area and check out a local Catholic church - but they won't let us serve until they've had a year to get to know us to make sure we're good Catholics. The parish on base accepts us dang near instantly - and as soon as they discover we want to serve we're on all the lists. :) My biggest stumbling block right now is that my people (Centering Prayer, meditation, social justice and theology, etc) can be hard to find on an installation,, which forces me out into the community to find these pockets of wisdom and strength.
Lynn, do you have any recommendations for ways of extended family of military to connect/build community when we’re not local? My younger brother is an ROTC cadet and likely entering active duty next year. I know very little about what the future holds for him and want to support him the best way possible!
Does anyone have a good answer to the same question but for dads?
I have no idea, but I'm following so I can see an answer!
Same! I remember reading a book years ago about how shafted mothers get financially in the U.S. and one of the chapters was about how little resources or networks there were for dads who at a minimum just wanted to "dad" better.
That thing where you know *exactly* what safe sleep FB group she’s talking about.
Honestly, I am now the parent of school age kids and one thing that strikes me is that it was so much easier to make friends when my kids were babies. We all knew we needed support and were THERE for each other. It seems like the more self-sufficient the kids get, the less the parents around us interact, if that makes sense?
A friend sent me one of Glennon Doyle's recent podcasts about friendships, and one of the things that hit home was how isolating it can be parenting teens. When they're younger they're in a way part of your own self so it feels somewhat okay talking openly about things, but as they move into teen years the struggles and heartaches are part of their own individual selves, not ours to share. I know there are books on parenting teens and teen brains, but I feel like there's a big gap in being able to step back as a parent and perceive this whole individual human becoming themselves while you're still a parent thing. Anyway, that's slightly tangential but feels slightly related to the decrease in parents connecting thing.
I have found the exact opposite to be true for me. Now that my daughter is in school, I have a chance to meet other parents. When she was younger, I was incredibly isolated, especially because I worked. And I worked mostly non-parents so they often totally didn’t grasp me leaving work and going to my second job as mom. I didn’t have the opportunity to build any relationships with other parents at all.
Oh this is interesting to me! I'm a new mom (babe is less than a year) and at least right NOW I feel very well supported by my Bumper group on Reddit, a local neighborhood mom group where we swap resources, and carefully choosing the mom content folks on Instagram. Also I have been on Babycenter for a loooong time. I stumbled across their "toxic inlaws & family" support groups at one point and never left. I'm happy to learn about Doree's newsletter though!
I was going to say, Reddit is just such a huge huge part of this now. Not just bumper groups (though my wife is active in both of hers and I think an enormous amount of her parenting content comes through that), but all sorts of other subs as well. I'm also in a couple neighborhood parent Facebook groups that are fairly active, to say nothing of the local PTO's website/portal/thingy and various WhatsApp chains and Google Groups for groups of parents of kids at one daycare or another.
Also, that DC group is not the last of its kind! Park Slope Parents in Brooklyn is still very much keeping its 1997-era message board running and very active (you have to pay dues to join and I think there are paid staff that moderate etc.) and I know there's a similar (rival?) group one neighborhood over for BoCoCa parents.
As a mom who is about to turn 35 tomorrow, the timing of this couldn't have been more perfect. I'm still on facebook but haven't really posted in the past month and have been missing mom spaces. Doree, I just subscribed and I'm looking forward to reading all of your posts!!
My kids are grown, so I'm not as on top of this as I used to be, but: Damn, do I miss the days of the decidedly-not-mainstream Hip Mama message boards in the early 2000s. They (and their successors) eventually imploded, but that info exchange and solidarity changed my life, and I'm still friends with so many of the women I met there. Maybe we should resurrect now and call it Hip Meno, cuz many of us are headed there if we're not there already...
I’ve been listening to Forever 35 off and mostly on since it first started. Doree and Kate have honestly dropped nuggets of wisdom on me that fully changed my life. Specifically, I now read for actual pleasure rather than reading (or not reading) literature because I feel like I have something to prove to my literature degree.
I didn’t know that Doree had started a parenting newsletter- now subscribed!
7 years ago when I first gave birth, the Longest Shortest Time Facebook group saved me. And then promptly (wishing 6 months) dissolved into infighting. I joined tons more Facebook groups only to never really find my people. Then the forever 35 group changed my life again because it felt safe to talk to people about superficial things, but also feel seen. I’ve since completely left Facebook. I only superficially skate across Instagram, and I’ve felt more disconnected. But then it’s also less of a time suck (more reading what I want to read).
I admit, I hesitate to try discord. Somehow engagement with strangers doesn’t scratch the itch it once did. Maybe because I am finally starting to make a few real friends. Maybe something else. I don’t know.
And yet here I am typing this comment into the abyss.
Anyway. I’m so glad you did this interview Anne! I’m very excited to dive into Doree’s newsletter.
Thank you so much for sharing Doree with us! I hadn't been made aware of her. I try and unpack a lot of the motherhood and identity issues in my Substack, The Mother Lode, which I launched in November 2021. I also have found a very welcoming and forthcoming group of mothers on Not Safe for Moms Group, which yes, is Facebook, but it just feels really good to have a space where it safe to talk about things many people DON'T talk about in mom groups. I also love what Mom Life Comics does on Instagram; it isn't a community. But it does make me feel seen in a very refreshing way.
(Tangential to the rest of this discussion, but I worked with Doree once and she was an amazing editor!)
Man, I miss the military mom blogs of the early 00s! Army Wife, Toddler Mom, Homefront Six, etc were mainstays to me a decade before I had kids!
And Pioneer Woman before she had her own show and Walmart stuff... not military, but fun mix of recipes and mom world.